next »

[Simon_Jeeha]

im wary of putting my neck out again especially since fynal says i am not his friend..

but he did give lots of people free iron and stuff. maybe that should count for something

[frozenjars]

It's finally gotten to be enough that I actually made an account here just to post on this thread. I get to see both sides.

In my opinion, it's neither just nor fair to allow someone to be set on a prison planet for longer than necessary. I understand what happened fully, however everyone's taken the time to calm their systems down. Everyone has days when they're not in the best mindset, something I think we can all agree to, and Fynal has done what he can to fix issues. That includes repairing what he has damaged in his attempts to mine on the prison planet. It's been fixed for a while now. In fact, he quit mining the second I told him that there was no ore to be found.

I will admit very openly that I am not one for all this dramatic stuff. It makes my blood pressure skyrocket in such a major way and I try to avoid it as much as I can. That being said, when I watch my husband invest his time so heavily to people, to projects, to anything, only to be locked out and told to basically "take" whatever punishment he's given, it sucks. It sucks because these are people he cares about, a project and ideal that he believes in so much, so dearly that he literally chooses time here over anything else. It also sucks because people that I thought were cool, decent players turned on him viciously and without much care or afterthought. It took all this turning dirt ugly to have people take a breath and realize things can be fixed.

What's an even bigger shame is how others are being treated because of this, and how some people aren't being treated at all. If someone has stolen, lied and has been not only accused of these crimes, but they have been shown to be true, they should be punished as well. It doesn't matter how well liked, disliked, loved or unloved they are. Justice is justice. It can't be doled out to one and not the other.
I have enjoyed playing here and getting to know people when I am on. Each person, before this, was really nice and open. Always willing to help. What was frustrating to me, in all of this, was how it was ignored and still seems to be.

If you want to let him stay there, fine. At least give him a time frame for which he has to stay instead of saying..."Oh, well, we'll wait and see."

This is my two cents on the entire matter and I hope for a resolution. Fynal has been working to achieve that and I see some people trying to give advice as to what to do. It's being done. I'm sure there are ways to check.

In short, let's all work together to find an actual solution to the issue instead of letting someone linger indefinitely. I'm sure no one would enjoy that themselves, no matter what they did/didn't do.

[Jonin420]

this is the last thing im gonna personally say about this im sry frozen for being a dick but you give what you get and he would have been let out already if this was his first offence this is his 3rd I personally don't trust him and I don't see how anyone else can either

[FynalSlash]

Luckily, Jonin, you don't speak for anyone else.

[FynalSlash]

But if we are going to bring priors into it as an indication of character, then by all means, let's actually get into that instead of just using them as a slag. No matter how bad it is, it is better to quantify these things than to pretend justification for an indefinite and endless detention. You referenced my attacking of lynnch. My bare handed single punch that was resolved, repaid, and settled. Enough so that he saw fit to let me work for him building an iron farm, as I in fact have done for you.

The other was my griefing of an area labeled PUBLIC, which I believed to be abandoned. As I recall, I confessed, apologized, asked where I could turn myself in, went there, and immediately asked what I could do to make it right once I learned otherwise. nixbeast can attest to that, and I'm still willing to help him build whatever he would like, the same as I did the day I was released and agreed to follow him and his orders about that whenever he would like. I even messaged him after the fact to let him know that if he ever wants me to do more, even though I didn't really play on that server, I would make myself available for whatever he wanted.

I've learned the hard way what is and isn't acceptable on the server. I've had bad times.. that no one particularly cared about.. or asked about.. because I have been assigned no actual representation by anyone whose job it is to make sure my side is heard or represented. I literally have no defense, and people have outright said that they would refuse to speak on my behalf. Funnily, had I committed some real life crime in a crap real life statism, I'd at least have appointed defense by now... to point out that a person is not ALL bad and NO good because his current actions were wrong. And they were. And the situation was resolved with Conan days ago. And resolved with the parties I was told I was being held because of, who have asked for no further reparations. Literally, the only thing unresolved at this point is hurt feelings. Are hurt feelings a reason for indefinite imprisonment now? I contend that they are not. I can't apologize any more than I already have. Only time can heal that. There is nothing about the situation which has not already, as the root of the problem, been resolved. Not even my mentality about the matter. ....Which, again, no one has even asked about...

Voluntaryism doesn't mean never doing anything wrong. Nothing human means that. It means always preferring peaceful resolution and non-aggression whenever possible. In every instance, I have always, historically, if we are delving into history, done everything I can to make good and to learn better. You could not factually say otherwise. Let us not pretend now, Jonin, that I'm the one now opposing peaceful resolution.

I have done wrong plenty of times. And I have admitted it was wrong and made reparations. Every time. I am not some wild griefer laughing about it and seeing how much I can get away with. When I have done wrong, I've always confessed to it, done what I could to make it right, tried to listen to the other party and see what restoration was possible. If they were up for it. If you will not reason with me, be clear and just say that. "I refuse to reason with you." Instead of portraying me as the unreasonable party. Because I've already resolved every issue there was with every party involved except for you, and that is sheerly because you outright refuse. But I also refuse to fight with you. I have always preferred reason, even when it was true that I didn't exercise peace as well as I wished or should have. I always preferred it. That much is true. I'm a work in progress. But my efforts are steadfast and sincere. No one for whom that was not true would still be here trying this adamantly. When I stumble, I right myself as I can. You wish to speak to my character through evidences of prior accounts? All of that is true. And everyone who has dealt with me, whether they like me or not, knows it to be true.

[Jonin420]

you being in prison is about you not me, im not involved in it anymore so stfu and stop acting like your locked up for something you said to me

[FynalSlash]

If you're backpedaling out of your terrorist tactics of conditionally threatening to quit if it was ever determined I'd served my time, made proper reparations and was released, I think that's great. I'd prefer everyone stay, keep playing, and move forward to better days.

[FynalSlash]

But to reiterate the actual point since you seem to have intentionally missed it, there are no parties damaged by my actions who have not already been made whole. If there are, let them come forward so that they may be. There is no reason for recurrence of my actions, since the parties involved have already squared up and made peace.

[Jonin420]

http://mc.intangir.org/index.php?topic=2955.msg19744;topicseen#new

[FynalSlash]

Yeah. I can't help but notice that it's empty and contains no claims.

[FynalSlash]

This is now my forth day locked up. With no actual restorative claims, just some pissed off people. This is becoming a real life "Charge me or release me" scenario. Either demonstrate some requirement I need to meet and allow me to meet it, or call it square and let me get back to playing having been punished. The trust of some I will never earn back. Not with any amount of time. Those are damages I have to live with now. I accept that. But it's time to move forward.

[zombienerd]

I agree that resolution one way or another needs to be brought.

It seems all victims of physical damage and property rights violation have been made whole, or have withdrawn.

Please see the post Simon made earlier today (and is linked a few posts back) and post if there are any further grievances.

I would ask whomever holds the pearl to monitor the threads listed for final resolution. 

In my opinion, if 24 hours passes with no further complaint or request, Fynal should be released.  What happens then is up to him.

Personally, I would recommend to Fynal that he should, in the future: use the /ignore feature extensively, keep his hands to himself unless attacked first, and not touch a single block that has been placed and/or modified by another player.  This is not intended as a personal attack in any way, just friendly advice. I was not online when this happened and only know what I was told and read here.

[SavanahMile]

I will have to inspect my shop, verify that actual stone was used to replace stone that was blown up. I second claim is listed on the new thread as well.

[FynalSlash]

Jonin, since as you've pointed out over and over in this thread, none of the reasons for my being held are in any way due to anything to do with you, I'd like my property you were holding for me returned upon release so that I can use it to pay reparations to Savanah and others as needed. (You can keep the Balrog Skull, of course.) Thanks.

[SavanahMile]

But if we are going to bring priors into it as an indication of character, then by all means, let's actually get into that instead of just using them as a slag. No matter how bad it is, it is better to quantify these things than to pretend justification for an indefinite and endless detention. You referenced my attacking of lynnch. My bare handed single punch that was resolved, repaid, and settled. Enough so that he saw fit to let me work for him building an iron farm, as I in fact have done for you.  
** Did you actually finish the iron farm for LordRagnarock?  ******

The other was my griefing of an area labeled PUBLIC, which I believed to be abandoned. As I recall, I confessed, apologized, asked where I could turn myself in, went there, and immediately asked what I could do to make it right once I learned.

*** Just to make clear it is not okay to grief any property you "think or deem abandoned."  I want this noted, because saying oh i thought it was abandoned is not an excuse for griefing.  NC and OC are a joined cities.  We have several players that can not be in two places at once, that does not invalidate a players property rights in any way ***

I've learned the hard way what is and isn't acceptable on the server. I've had bad times.. that no one particularly cared about.. or asked about.. because I have been assigned no actual representation by anyone whose job it is to make sure my side is heard or represented. I literally have no defense, and people have outright said that they would refuse to speak on my behalf. Funnily, had I committed some real life crime in a crap real life statism, I'd at least have appointed defense by now... to point out that a person is not ALL bad and NO good because his current actions were wrong. And they were. And the situation was resolved with Conan days ago. And resolved with the parties I was told I was being held because of, who have asked for no further reparations. Literally, the only thing unresolved at this point is hurt feelings. Are hurt feelings a reason for indefinite imprisonment now? I contend that they are not. I can't apologize any more than I already have. Only time can heal that. There is nothing about the situation which has not already, as the root of the problem, been resolved. Not even my mentality about the matter. ....Which, again, no one has even asked about...

** To clarify, I attempted to assist you when all this starting going wrong, not only did you not want my help you told me "Fuck all of you."  This could have all be resolved at that point and cleared up, but it was your actions that drove a continuous downward spiral of where we are now.  So please see you never had to be in this position in the first place, but you seemed to want to keep pressing to see what would happen, and now you know.  Simon who you said is not your friend created the justice council to keep people from being put in a chest and left.  I do see you playing the marter here and it is not accurate, so stick to the facts thats your best case.  so I am clarifying, you were offered help, and not just by me on day 1, you refused, insulted, continued your path, attacked others, and got Pearled on both maps, so in a statist world you would have been shot and killed on day one and no one would be reading this now.  Know that to be true. Dam statists.  ***

Voluntaryism doesn't mean never doing anything wrong. Nothing human means that. It means always preferring peaceful resolution and non-aggression whenever possible. In every instance, I have always, historically, if we are delving into history, done everything I can to make good and to learn better. You could not factually say otherwise. Let us not pretend now, Jonin, that I'm the one now opposing peaceful resolution.  
** Please realize Voluntaryism means the voluntary interaction between two parties as well **

I have done wrong plenty of times. And I have admitted it was wrong and made reparations. Every time. I am not some wild griefer laughing about it and seeing how much I can get away with. When I have done wrong, I've always confessed to it, done what I could to make it right, tried to listen to the other party and see what restoration was possible. If they were up for it. If you will not reason with me, be clear and just say that. "I refuse to reason with you." Instead of portraying me as the unreasonable party. Because I've already resolved every issue there was with every party involved except for you, and that is sheerly because you outright refuse. But I also refuse to fight with you. I have always preferred reason, even when it was true that I didn't exercise peace as well as I wished or should have. I always preferred it. That much is true. I'm a work in progress. But my efforts are steadfast and sincere. No one for whom that was not true would still be here trying this adamantly. When I stumble, I right myself as I can. You wish to speak to my character through evidences of prior accounts? All of that is true. And everyone who has dealt with me, whether they like me or not, knows it to be true.

** Just clairifying you are admitting repeat offenses, horse murder, destruction of property, and even though you say hey i'm sorry, some times sorry will not be okay, and that is the real story behind what Jonin was trying to say.  Basically what next?  Will you play okay for a week, then destroy property, and ask for restitution, not really forgiveness, just, "Auh, what do I owe you for your crap I broke? a block of iron, here, we good okay bye sucker."  so we do not want that to be the case.  ***

I listed what needs to be done to repay me, because I have a claim!
it doesn't win my trust in any way, it just resolves my loss, so you can move forward.  Time and consistency are the only things that can do that for you, but I'm trying to be honest about it because I am a hard ass, been burned before.    It is a game as our Lovely VBELAC has pointed out to people, folks want you to play, just don't use adult tactics against a 12 year old girl that is the way she is because, hmm maybe her irl isn't so awesome.  On the Internet we never know what someone has to go through in the real world every dam day.  So no PM'ing a minor your adult thoughts, just type /ignore and call it a day.