Anarchic Frontiers Minecraft Server

no one on it actually cares about truth or justice or voluntaryism

jonin stole a pearl from the justice council vaults

no one wants to do a god damn thing about it

he lied to me, he made shit up, i am pretty sure he cussed at me

everyone told me to, and i quote "shut the fuck up"

and drop it

no one cares about justice

no one cares about basic decency
no one cares about truth

i used a bad word so i lose, even though EVERYONE ELSE HAS BEEN CUSSING CONSTANTLY ALL DAY, since yesterday, and there is a /censor command

i specifically ask, all i got from anyone was 'i sorta care'

wow..

he just doesn't care in my case apparently

i quit

ive been on this server for over 2 years but because jonin gives free shit to people i guess his opinion and his assinine behavior is worth more than mine

so enjoy it

i guess he can randomly break and change terms and take pearls and hold people for whatever reasons he decides and no one else can have a say even if he agreed they would

this server used to be a place of learning and discussion

now it isn't, it is just a clique where some are more popular and those who aren't can "SHUT THE FUCK UP"


he makes ultimatums that it is his way or he will quit

all of this over 1 fucking guy

well how would you feel if the whole server teamed up on you and no one , not one, stood up for you

i have been heavily wronged and my concerns are completely ignored

but jonin is called a pedophile and POOR JONIN oh no we are all supposed to turn our gaze while he unilaterally holds someone without offer of restitution because his feelings were hurt

You should not quit you will be missed.

Don't let a griefer get everyone turning on one another.
Jonin went too far and you went to far, but the cool thing about this server is everyone excepts everyone for who they are.  Too much badgering all dam day over this.

New Dawn seems to be laid out cool like New Haven, best city I have been in, big lots.

I appreciate your principles.

you told me to drop it

now you care?

so this is how justice works now? people threaten to quit?

im not joking, it isn't a power move, im serious, this server has taught me that voluntaryism probably won't ever work because cliques and peoples irrational preferences win out over actual pursuit of truth and justice

thats all i need to know

I know how you feel exactly, Simon. Just wait 2-3 months and it'll be fine. If you're like me then it's all you're gonna think about. Atleast for the first few weeks :P

sorry simon i know how you feel

when i was more involved i got accused of admin crimes and accused of being a dictator too

so i stopped playing

this is specifically why i didn't officially join the justice council, because i knew people would claim i was a dictator

and instead they claimed you were. sorry..

i appreciate your being a part of the server and i think if you actually quit you will be sorely missed..

i am also becoming quite disillusioned in the teaching potential of the server..

"whole server teaming up on you"

I kind of know the feeling if my memory serves me

the only thing and biggest thing you did wrong was going on a huge rant and acting like a caged gorilla

after that it was all downhill

everyone got pretty sick of you pretty quick

and now saying you quit throwing a tantrum just makes it even worse

remember when i almost quit that one time?

you have got to get control of your emotions, you've ALWAYS been this way ALWAYS

getting so wound up, so fast, so ballistic

omg..

is the pearl actually your property?
should there be a specific rule that at the exact second a pearl is placed in there it can never be taken back out by the person who put it there in the first place?
or maybe a grace period until a pearl is set in stone and unmovable?
keep in mind it was only some hours later that it was taken back out
these are all reasonable questions that should be addressed


yet another example of how 1 greifer can separate a server

i dont want you to quit, i dont want jonin to quit, i think you two should work the hard feelings out slow and steady

it's actually sometimes fun with you around simon

i wouldve stood up for you but as the server owner people either rail against my direct involvement, or submit to it without thinking about it

my hands are pretty much tied on direct involvement in issues..

i will say i that i am pretty sorry to see how things played out

don't quit i only just came back..

Sadly I can't take sides dude, since I didn't really witness anything. But don't leave over this :(

great so your saying stuff about me after i left huh. thats nice

anyway here is my position on this

1) i didn't want to just let fynal go, i just don't want to pearl someone away without due process. i made this abundantly clear, i didn't let him go when i had the opportunity to already. i think there ARE valid reasons for keeping him pearled for now, and i made that clear in game and on the forum.. so i don't know why you would think you needed to break your agreement to cut me out of the process when i already proved i wasn't going to unilaterally do whatever i felt like doing, and already clearly said i wasn't going to

2) since the justice council i have never just gone and freed anyone or said someone is absolved without discussion, never.

3) you claimed you agreed to the terms, savanah, and intangir, and vbelac and commander didn't but YOU did. so did a couple others, like igloo who joined afterward. So for commander to keep his own private vault and not necessarily follow the rules he never agreed to is one thing, but for you, you agreed.

4) when i brought this up you flat out lied, you said i wanted to give people 100 chances, i never gave this guy a single chance, because i never had an opportunity where it was even up to me alone. i didn't pearl him the first time, YOU did, i didn't pearl him the second time, someone else did, i didn't store his pearl YOU did. i didn't let him loose though, but that is because i don't think it was just to just let him go on my own. the very thing you claim as your justification for treating me like shit is they exact thing i DIDN'T and have NEVER done.

5) i shouldn't have used such bad language when you started lying about me, but i was just so surprised by your completely unfounded lies, completely without any cause! not only had i done nothing to you, not only was the only reason you tried to cut me out already proven wrong, but i had never done any of the things you claim i did! none! the rules are clearly defined, i never changed them, you agreed, there is no simon club, there is no simon council, it is and has always been about justifying our actions according to reason and principle and philosophy, that is the case when we started it, it is the case now, it has never changed, i have never acted out of line with that goal.. never.. not once since we started it.. even before when i was acting on my own i was acting according to those principles. always. why wouldn't i? that is what i believe in firmly. if i have a personal beef with someone i don't pearl them, i just ignore them! if it is a matter of actual wrongs and violation then i might pearl them but i always explain the REASONS, i am not afraid of justice and truth. i don't hide from it, i don't try to cheat it. when me and commander fought over the carriage of justice before it wasn't because one of us just thought we would cheat it and go about doing whatever we felt like regardless, it was because we disagreed on exactly what was just, and i think we both realized that about the other which is why i still respected him and i think he still respected me

6) im sorry for using the lords name in vain, i know several of you are christians and that is probably why you turned your back on me when jonin was flat out lying about me, im sorry, i will try to better respect other peoples beliefs even if i don't share them. i was just so shocked be the audacity of his complete lies that i just.. lost my cool, i just couldn't believe the nerve..  i mean if it was a partial bending or smearing of the facts that wouldn't be quite so amazing,. but it was 100% a complete lie! was just shocking!

7) the main reason i quit is because i flat out said that i was only interested in seeing things like pearling only be used if it was just and based on justice and truth, i said doesn't anyone else care about truth and justice, i asked 2 or 3 times, only one person even responded to it, zombienerd who said he didn't have a dog in the fight or something like that so he wasn't going to get involved. except you DO have a dog in the fight, because you play here, and if people can be pearled and kept pearled hiding from the process of justification, avoiding the process of possible restitution and letting people go because they are in a bad mood or because 'ill quit' then that is bullshit.. i am not quitting because things didn't go my way, but i will quit if i am the only one on the server that actually cares about things going the JUST way.. the pearls are way to powerful for them to be used by people for petty personal reasons. anyone who is going to use them must be held accountable to a justifiable standard, that is why i wanted to help make the justice council.


these are still my beliefs, if this server is supposedly about voluntaryism, and learning, and teaching about justice and basing our actions on truth and not just whims, and delusions and personal opinions, than we need to hold to that standard, defend it, defend those who are attacked trying to uphold it with totally made up lies based on distorted out of touch views or way out dated crap out of context..

we were all fooled by shystan and we all learned from it, bringing up 2 years old mistakes that we have already learned from and have worked to prevent again is stupid. jonin has also made mistakes in the past but i don't throw those in his face when they are no longer relevant


basically i don't want to play with people if there is no respect for higher ideals like voluntaryism and  truth and justice, thats the only reason i am playing here, if i wanted to play on a server that had a cool setup, i mean there are plenty of other servers that have cool setups, the only thing that makes this one special (i thought) was the rights respecting players and the higher ideals


if anyone else still shared a respect for those ideals please let me know now or i am just going to give up on the idea and on the server. im not saying you have to join the justice league and obey its rules, i am just saying, if you are going to pearl people, you should be willing to justify your actions, and if you are going to say things about people (apparently behind their back!) you should be saying thats that are based on facts, not lie. and if you see people lieing, stand up for them, don't just cow down to some liar because he gives people free crap and threatens to quit..

i know it is stupid me saying he is lame for threatening to quit but the reasons are different, he just said flat out i will quit if he is released but didn't explain his reasons, i am giving all of the reasons why i wouldn't want to play here..

oh yea also jonin explicitly agreed to follow the terms of the justice council, and specifically used his access to violate those rules and take property from justice council custody in violation to the terms he agreed to

i consider that theft, when i brought that up everyone just totally ignored it..

even people who are on the council, even people who know that his only reasoning for it was to obstruct justice! even people who know that the person he wanted to cut out of the process, ME, already DIDN'T do, and said i wouldn't do what he thought i would do, when i already had the chance.. so what the hell.. this is why it seems clear NO ONE HERE ACTUALLY CARES ABOUT JUSTICE

if no one cares what am i to expect next? can jonin steal from my vault? can jonin kill my horses? what can he not do if he can blatantly lie cheat and steal and on one EVEN CARES.

I obviously care about truth and justice and voluntaryism

i wouldve spoken up but i try to let things unfold naturally without influencing them

i think maybe people just weren't watching chat, or maybe couldn't keep up or maybe they were burned out from the drama

i definitely do care though and i hope others also do.. that is what the server is about is providing an environment for these concepts to be illustrated, and for people to have fun playing together too

i stood up for you in game today when jonin was talking behind your back, i certainly don't approve of the global chat being used to talk behind peoples back, especially to lie..

ofcourse as soon as i did i got called out for my improper behavior..

there is just no winning as the server owner, i am damned if i do and damned if i don't, having a player who has more power than others on a server that is trying to illustrate anarchism is a bit contradictory, but inevitably when you are dealing with a video game that is hosted on physical hardware.. someone is going to own it, and someone is going to admin it.. it is unavoidable, i have tried to eliminate the influence as much as possible, but at the same time i do have an interest in the server and do have an interest in its direction.. so it is very hard to know where the line is that i should walk on..

at this point i feel like i should get involved, i find it very hard to remain silent when i see injustices going on and being left uncorrected..

yea thanks for that and i appreciate you hosting the server and getting involved, but like you say, you barely actually play anymore

i am hoping there are other active players that also care

I encourage you to get involved again, Intangir. I've become pretty bored with the game and somewhat disillusioned about the community lately and I think having you more active in the community would be good for the server. Just my two cents.

i like and agree with nearly everything you said

this is a much better approach

at the time, i didnt know jonin was actually going against the rules when he gave me the pearl to hold

i have a personal vault for my own reasons, and everybody has a say who gets locked in there just like on the justice council vault, just like any other player

and i will respectfully be open to any objections and will hold myself accountable to the voluntary principle

like i always have

jonin had his reasons for wanting another party to hold the pearl too, but since he already put in there and agreed to certain terms, that would be hard to justify

i think just forgiving eachother and moving on and learning from this is best

i do respect you simon, and most of the time i enjoy your company on the server with us

don't quit

I thought about it but now that everyone is on survey i have to start all over again ;)

i probably will its just a matter of when, i always have in the past

sometimes when we start new features i end up having to spend alot of time making adjustments and observing the impact rather than getting to enjoy it

honestly i know commander still doesn't like it but i think given how many diamonds are coming up i think it is about balanced, i do want the diamonds to be harder to get (than vanilla), but still easy enough to get if you are determined and put forward a reasonable amount of investment in it, i think with the str2 potions, or the eff5 picks, it is pretty much where i want it now

there are strategies that work great, jonin is doing them
and they are quickly becoming more accessible to more people.. i know it was too hard at first but i do think it is pretty much where it ought to be at this point

Simon, I'm sorry if I came across as not caring.  That was not my intent.  I should have clarified.  I try not to get involved in things or state an opinion until I have had a chance to review the 'facts', if any are discernible.  I tried to mediate between the parties in the original squabbles, but I'm not that great of a mediator and mostly ended up being a messenger to pass along messages to people who were ignoring each other.

Having spent some time reading the posts, and looking at the council, I am in agreement with you.  This was mishandled.  I definitely care about agreements being kept.  I think the council is a great idea, and I'd be more than willing to join if you'd have me.

I saw Jonin admit fault today, and he seems remorseful in my opinion.  I'm sure things can be patched up.  When cooler heads prevail, I'm sure the discussion can be held on why maintaining ones word as to agreed upon terms is paramount in a voluntary society.

There was much anger all around, and it is never a good time to start a discussion when angry.

If you come back on, I'd be more than glad to have some discussions about how to move forward, and do my best to help mediate a peaceful, perhaps amicable resolution.

ok well maybe i was too hasty and people just needed time to know the facts

i thought the justice council terms were common enough knowledge but i guess not

i got a message from lynch also who is also still interested in the things i am interested in and those things together help to reinstill some confidence that i am not the only one who shares my values here..

im sorry for being so quick to judgement and also for using the bad language related to his flying holiness, i just forgot that so many people on would be offended by it.. i mean, other bad language seems to be thrown around all of the time without much concern

I am sry simon for everything

I said some mean things last night and kept on even today until I was told off, im sry for talking bad too you and about you when you were gone, if you ever need anything im still willing to help out just wanted you to know, we don't have to be friends but we don't have to be enemies

lol this group really is something, vbelac has a point it is a game, but we enjoy playing it this way i guess..

i don't know, we invest alot in it and it seems more important because we are making a model of something we believe in.. some of us at least.. i feel kind of silly looking at it now even a couple of days later..

oh well i still think its an important ideal and that even though this is a game, we make it more than that for a good reason..

experience is experience wether its in real life, a game, even a dream sometimes.. people learn from experiences, doesn't matter where

Oh and Simon, I really hope you don't quit. Something will always happen like this. And it stinks, but just give it time and hopefully we'll forget all about it. And stop bringing back things that happend 3 months ago. :D (please don't take this as mean)